Read this story in | Add a translation >>

A message from Gente Unida and the o.r.g.a.n.i.c. collective

Please mobilize...this is a critical event in stopping the momentum of the Minutemen and the growing anti-immigration movement.

PLEASE BE THERE BY 6pm. Traffic will be awful, so plan accordingly (see Coaster information below). Bring noise makers, signs, banners, cameras and creative strategies for challenging these racists!

EVENT DATE: Thursday, August 11, 2005

TIME: 7-9 pm LOCATION: Carlsbad Community Cultural Arts Center
3557 Monroe St., Carlsbad 92008

Event details:
The Defense of Our Nation Begins at Our Borders
SENATOR BILL MORROW invites you to a Public Forum

For a frank discussion on how Illegal Immigration affects Health Care, Homeland Security, Education, Economy & the Environment with:

*CONGRESSMAN TOM TANCREDO Chairman, Congressional Immigration Reform Caucus *James W. Gilchrist Founder, MinuteMan Project *Dr. Madeleine Cosman, Esq. Pulitzer Prize Nominee, Medical Lawyer & Health Care Expert *Pete Nunez Former Assistant Secretary of the U.S. Treasury, U.S. Attorney * Roger Hedgecock, Emcee

Background on this Forum: Originally, it was called for by State Senator Bill Morrow as a safe, public space for republicans, neo-cons and community members to get out their fears of the 'other' by scapegoating migrants. But with all the bad press the Minutemen have been getting and the violence associated with them, the Carlsbad school chief canceled it. The neo-cons and closet racists got mad, pressuring Bill Morrow not to back down. So he sued the school superintendant!. And now, the klan meeting, err, I mean, Town Meeting is back on

God Bless Freedom. See you there


Thursday, August 11, 2005
7 - 9 pm
Carlsbad Community Cultural Arts Center
3557 Monroe St., Carlsbad 92008

For information, call: 760.434.7930

Directions: From the I-5, exit Carlsbad Village Dr. & head east. Right onto Monroe St., look for 3557 Monroe.

COASTER INFORMATION: To take the Coaster to Carlsbad costs $4.25 each way. You can bring your bike onto the train, which may be useful because the event is 1.8 miles away from the station.

Coaster Departs: 4:22pm from Sante Fe (Downtown) Station, 4:27pm from Old Town Station

Coaster Arrives: 5:07 at Carlsbad Village (2775 State St.)

To get to the forum: Take State St. South to Carlsbad Village Dr., Go East 1 mile, Turn Rigt on Monroe St. and go 1/2 mile to 3557 Monroe.



Please Don't Feed the Trolls

Wikipedia defines an Internet Troll as: "either a person who sends messages on the Internet hoping to entice other users into angry or fruitless responses, or a message sent by such a person." San Diego IMC strives to provide both a grassroots media resource as well as a forum for people to contribute to a meaningful discussion about local issues. Please, when posting comments, be respectful of others and ignore those trying to interrupt or discourage meaningful discourse. Thank you.

-- San Diego Indymedia volunteers
  Download this article in pdf format >>

  Make a quick comment on this article>>


Good luck

10.08.2005 15:24


Good luck disrupting the forum in a legal manner, it's indoors on a highschool campus.

See you there!

La Migra's Helper



Open to the Public

10.08.2005 15:48


Isn't that the whole basis behind the law suit?

The forum is open to the public and you may ask questions - the Minutemen insist on it being a forum that does not deny anyone their first ammendment rights.

Pachuco



Neo Cons SUPPORT Open Borders

10.08.2005 18:59



Bush is your buddy, not ours

VivaLaMigra



come one, come all!

10.08.2005 19:05


see you anarchists/communists there!

-mike almeida

pinche pocho



I never Knew This was a Minutemen Event?

10.08.2005 19:18


I thought ths was just everyday U.S. Citizens and California Residents having a townhall meeting. You can only keep calling us Racists for so long. Anyone with half a brain knows that the United States is made up of many different races! And Thanks for the publicity! This meeting has had so much media coverage! That is what should make you afraid! It is the Law abiding Americans that will ake a difference.
R/ Skip " I'll be there "

Skip
e-mail:: dadakulit@yahoo.com



Just in case

10.08.2005 20:27


Ummmm, don't forget bail money ...


jarhead



MOBILIZE!!

11.08.2005 08:03


EVERYONE GET UP TO CARLSBAD TONIGHT! CALL IN SICK! CARPOOL! TAKE THE COASTER!

JAMES GILCHRIST IS AN IDIOT. YOU GOTTA GO JUST TO SEE HOW F*CKED UP HIS IDEAS ARE. WATCH HIM TURN HIS EYES DOWN OR SCRATCH HIS NOSE WHEN HE SAYS HE'S NOT A RACIST. THOSE ARE TELLTALE SIGNS WHEN SOMEONE'S LYING.

EVERYONE CONSIDERING GOING OUT, DON'T LET THE OTHER COMMENTS FREAK YOU OUT. NEOCONS ARE GOOD AT THREATENING. AND TERRIBLE AT ORGANIZING.

THE HUMAN RIGHTS - AND LIVES - OF MIGRANT WORKERS ARE AT STAKE! LAST MONTH ALMOST A HUNDRED PEOPLE PERISHED IN THE DESERT - IN JULY ALONE!
CAN YOU IMAGINE DYING LIKE THAT? EVER TRIED THAT HARD TO FIND WORK?

SEE YOU TONIGHT. LET'S TAKE LA LUCHA TO CARLSBAD!

s t a r r



Yet to see...

11.08.2005 09:07


Just a note, I have yet to see a single Klansman or Nazi at a Minuteman event, and I've been around since the original April operation. We turned back many, many applications and people because we did not want to be associated with White Supremacists or Nazis, anymore than we want to be associated with truly violent people who DO want to "hunt" illegals.

It's just as hard for us to fend off Nazis & white supremacists who want to work alongside us as it is for you (if you wanted to) to fend off Communists, violent Anarchists, etc.

La Migra's Helper



We're being tricked - Meeting is being moved!

11.08.2005 10:15


The racist Minutemen have been e-mailing everyone that their meeting tonight is at the Carlbad Cultural Arts Center, but a reliable friend has gotten ahold of a flyer they're going to give out. Basically, they will give the flyer only to the recists at the parking lot of the Carlbad Cultural Center (where the meeting is supposed to be), and the flyer tells the Minutemen where to go for the meeting. There's a last minute switch to throw us off, and the flyer has directions to the new place. I'm going to scan in the flyer as soon as I can and post here. But I have the address of the new meeting hall for the racists meeting in Carlsbad.

San Diego North Convention Center
6120 Paseo Del Norte Ste L1
Carlsbad, CA 92009-1100
(760) 603-1690

TELL EVERYONE! We only have hours, not days, to swarm these a-holes and send them packing.

United for peace,

1People

1People
Homepage::



Ummm

11.08.2005 10:28


We didn't turn around and leave when Mexican drug dealers shot at us in Jacumba last month; what makes you think a bunch of rioters with bullhorns is going to make any difference?

You have a legal right to a PEACEFUL assembly, so by all means assemble peacefully. Good luck getting all your troops to the actual meeting location!

La Migra's Helper



Free speech... impressive

11.08.2005 10:38


I love how my comments get deleted when they rain on the parade of this site's biased editorialism...



La Migra's Helper



we know how scared you are

11.08.2005 11:01


We're going to be there and send you racists back into hiding.

The people of California are not going to let you do this shit in the open. The content of this forum, talking about how mexican people bring disease for example, is filled with racist misinformation.

There's no way you're going to be able to have this open public forum in peace in this town, fuckers.

Why are you racists? Simple:

1. A law that kills 3,200 people is an immoral law
2. A law that kills 3,200 people of color is a racist law
3. A bunch of people who want to enforce that law on their own are RACIST VIGILANTES.

There are racist laws, and our border policies are just that. Remember the laws that said that black people couldn't sit at the same lunch counter? This is the equivalent, and you are the equivalent of the Klan trying to defend it.

See you tonight, fuckers.

anarchist



Yeah, and...

11.08.2005 11:17


Your logic and reasoning are deficient.

Just because the vast majority of the people trying to illegally cross the Mexican border are of one particular nationality is not the law or the border's doing.

The Border Patrol is not forcing people to hike through the desert without enough food and water to survive, they are doing of their own accord. They have the opportunity to do two things -

1. Take back their own country and run their own nation the way they want to.

2. Immigrate to the US via legal process at a port of entry as per US law on it's own soil & sovreignty.

If we were scared of you, why are we still here? All we are doing is peaceably assembling and discussing national security and enforcement of sovreignty & security laws which every other country has and enforces on it's own, around the world.

I will fight and die for your right to object and disagree with me, the US Constitution grants you that basic human right to dissent and opinion. However what you are now demonstrating with your posts is a vehement hate and aggression, not a peaceful cause for change.

We are doing nothing illegal and (hopefully) neither are you, this is a democratic republic, and as law abiding and tax paying citizens we have a right to be heard in matters of national and state law, as do you.

However we are only allowed to be heard in a law-abiding fashion. Should you choose to break the law to make yourself heard, you are on your own, and you only weaken your own cause.


La Migra's Helper



the accident theory

11.08.2005 13:58


oh yes, la migras helper, its all a happy accident that thousands of people are crossing into our country of the same race everyday. it has nothing to do with us, surely. For heavens sake no! We are all innocent americans. Who have no responsibility for anything that happens across that line in the desert called the border. oh yes, mr helper, its all so strange how they come here when all we want to do it talk about security. its so weird how they keep wanting to die in the desert. Isnt it? I mean, there must be nobody inside mexico working for social change. zilch. lobbying the mexican government must be the only way to solve their problems. right? Oh yes. America, we are guilt-free. And so are our multinational institutions. and free trade agreements. and military aid. and maquiladora EPZ's. Oh yes, how funny this world is? we're just having a nice, rational conversation about our country's security with people who carry guns and hunt migrants. Oh I love reason. Those anarchists are bad! so bad. I mean, listen to what they say on their website!

"Our VISION is:
· A nonviolent world free from oppression, arbitrary borders, and the domination of individuals
· A global economy based upon cooperation between local autonomous communities
· An ecologically conscious world in which long-term sustainability takes precedence over material greed "

And their values are EVIL!!!!!!:

"Our VALUES include:
· Anti-authoritarianism
· Community autonomy
· Human rights
· Global solidarity
· Equality
· Economic justice"

Oh yes. they're the enemy. I mean listen to them! Economic Justice! they must not care about securing oil supplies for the rest of us who need them for our nice cars.

Oh how lovely my world is. All the problems are nice and separated out. Nothing is connected, related. Historical facts are irrelevant. Every country is completely separate. Legal Immigration is just and fair and cheap and just as easy as Americans visiting other countries. The border helps friendship. And deaths are normal. Oh yes, a nice wonderful fantasyland of world it is.

Tutuloo! See you later my friends. I'm off to put flowers on my son's grave, who died in Iraq for other peoples money.

Mrs. Judith Arenson
e-mail:: Jarenson@earthlink.net



Causes of migration

11.08.2005 14:11


"The international migration of people is largely driven by economic and social forces, including neocolonialism, demand created by consumers and the agribusiness industry, desire to secure a higher earning power, benefits such as education and healthcare, other multinational corporations seeking cheaper labor, unemployment in less-developed nations, globalization, wars, repression, resistance to various involuntary military servitude (such as conscription, "the draft" or its peacetime equivalent the National Service), and sexism."

-from wikipedia
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_immigration

wiki-reader
Homepage::



The Immigrants: Myths and Reality

11.08.2005 14:30


To hear many anti-immigration groups tell it, people who move to the United States from abroad these days are a pretty sorry lot.

Immigrants, these groups say, come here to suck up free social services, not to better themselves. If they do work, they steal jobs from Americans and increase unemployment.

They bring all kinds of diseases with them, and once here they despoil the environment for native-born Americans. To many people, these kinds of statements have the ring of truth.

But studies from an array of groups — from the conservative Cato Institute to the liberal National Immigration Forum to the nonpartisan National Academy of Sciences — give the lie to these unfounded allegations.

Here is the truth about some of these myths:


MYTH: Immigrants use more government services than they pay for with their taxes.

REALITY: Actually, the National Academy of Sciences found that the average immigrant annually contributes $1,800 more in taxes than he or she receives in benefits. Over their lifetimes, immigrants and their children will each pay an average $80,000 more in taxes than they will receive in local, state and federal benefits combined.

Because states provide most services used by immigrants, they can be net financial losers, while the federal government is typically a net gainer.


MYTH: Immigrants increase unemployment and reduce wages.

REALITY: In line with a number of other studies, the Cato Institute found that immigrants do not increase joblessness, even among the lowest-paid workers. The institute studied the relationship of unemployment and immigration between 1900 and 1989 and found "no statistically reliable correlation" between the two.

Other studies have found that immigration either has no effect on wage levels or, at worst, a very slight effect on a very small number of the lowest paid jobs in high-immigrant areas.

There is a consensus among business leaders that immigration is vital to maintaining economic growth. Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan said recently that immigration is critical to mitigating "inflation pressures."


MYTH: Immigrants bring disease.

REALITY: Even though most immigrants come from countries poorer than the United States, recent immigrants are healthier than the U.S.-born population in virtually every particular.

The Cato Institute also found that general health indicators like birth weight and infant mortality are better among babies born to immigrants than to U.S.-born mothers.


MYTH: Immigrants degrade the environment.

REALITY: Since 1965, when the current high levels of immigration began, there is no evidence that the environment has worsened overall. In fact, many environmental indicators like air and water quality have generally improved.

The Cato Institute, citing the data's complexity, reported that it could not "prove a causal connection" between environmental problems and the number of immigrants entering the United States.


Intelligence Report
Spring 2001

Southern Poverty Law Center
Homepage::



Need a tin foil hat

11.08.2005 14:34


Funny, because... no one but the illegal immigrants are pushing their own selves to try and illegally cross our borders and die trying.

I need to buy you and the anarchists some high quality tin foil hats one of these days, do you really believe all these multinational, big "evil" corporations are trying to opress Mexico as a country? As far as I can see they are taking advantage (an unfair advantage...) of cheap illegal labor streaming out of Mexico, where there are few to no jobs available for the average person.

I can agree with you that FTAs like NAFTA/CAFTA are a joke, but ultimately both Mexico and the USA are sovreign nations, and just as how nothing on the north side of the fence is any responsibility or business of Mexicans, so it is that nothing south of the fence is any responsibility or business of Americans.

We are no Caza Migrantes, we are simply citizens wanting to protect our homeland. No Minuteman has ever harmed in any way an illegal immigrant, I in fact helped four cold, dehydrated Mexicans up from under a bridge in the middle of the night (one of them a boy whom I had to lift up around barbed wire) this past April; apparently their Coyote had abandoned them and they were stuck under an Arizona highway near my post. We offered them water and blankets, no one accepted. They were picked up by the Border Patrol and processed out of the country into which they crossed illegally. No harm was done, nor has it ever at our hands, as we are all law-abiding citizens.

We carry arms for the same reason you drive with car insurance, for the same reason the Border Patrol carry weapons. I was shot at in Jacumba by a drug smuggler; had one of my crew or myself actually been hit, do I not have a basic human right to self defense? Does not everyone have this right?

No country can simply sustain such a massive and rapid influx of illegal immigrants, whatever their nationality. Did you know that of all outstanding arrest warrants in Los Angeles county, roughly 80% are for criminals who are also illegally here?

A sovreign nation has the right to control what and who enters it. Were the borders to be truly secured and enforced as per laws already in place, a guest worker program as seen in Europe would actually be feasible, would it not?

As a group we all find drug smugglers and hardcore criminals who cross our borders to be infinitely more damaging and dangerous than someone who crosses simply out of desperation and a search for better working conditions. But the bottom line is they both cross our borders illegally, and without us having any knowledge of who or what is crossing.

For all I know any given person walking up to the fence while I am on watch could be a hardcore multiple homicide murderer, or he could simply be a man looking for a better life but going about it the wrong way - there is no way to know, this is why every country has ports of entry; where a person is checked and verified.

While this may be seen as unfair by otherwise law-abiding citizens simply looking for work, it is every nation's perogative as to the form of legal process used, it is the criminal element and human nature itself that makes this kind of verification and checking absolutely necessary.

We, concerned citizens, are being made out to be racists and violent "Migrant hunters" simply because we carry weapons for self defenese and we assist a Federal agency in performing a necessary, law enforcement activity.

Taking the line of the Anarchists and Communists, there is no reasoning involved that anyone can really argue with or against there. Since day one, the world has never seen a successful Anarchist or Communist culture dominate world society; because it is an ultimately broken idea which leaves no room at all for the prevention of our most damaging disease: human nature, and the sin therein.

La Migra's Helper



Residents do it all the time

11.08.2005 14:39


To my knowledge - and I have been paying close attention - no patrol volunteers have arrested illegal aliens in Campo. We residents, however, do it all the time.

Why? Because illegal aliens and the coyotes who both lead and abuse those people, constantly harm us and our property. SO, when we go out to the barn and find it full people who have ripped up the hay to make bedding and left the water running all night, which destroys our wells, we arrest them and turn them over to Border Patrol.

When we find that the local smuggler has killed or maimed our dog, who was guilty only of barking at trspassers in his own yard, we get pissed off and arrest anyone who comes onto our properties after dark and turn them over to Border Patrol.

When we find that our fences have been cut and all our livestock impounded because the animals were wandering around on the public road - or killed by a truck, we start patrolling our own properties at night - sometimes with a neighbor - and arrest anyone we find and turn them over Border Patrol.

When we come home from work (that's how we make the payments on what is still OUR castle, however humble) to find that people have broken in, used our phone for long distance calls, eaten up our food, and ripped off our clothes, we feel so violated that we go out and buy a gun to sleep with.

When we hear a noise at 3 a.m. and look out the window to see a bunch of people bunched up around our car trying to hotwire it, that's a crime in progress and we call the deputies AND the Border Patrol and go out and arrest their asses at gunpoint.

When we hear someone trying to jimmy the lock on the patio door outside our bedrooms, we are liable to sneak out the other door and go around behind to get the drop on those would-be criminals.

We're not ashamed of this - not even a little - because we think we have human rights too. A whole bunch of us think Gente Unida and their ilk are criminals who don't care about the human rights of anyone - because, if they did, they wouldn't demand that we allow this to continue to the detriment of both Mexican and U.S. citizens. We think that we have been forced by both Mexican and U.S. governments to act as this country's first line of defense from a whole bunch of criminals who would cheerfully trample us into dust to make a buck.

Most Americans do not feel FORCED to go out and buy a gun to defend their homes. We - whether white, brown, yellow or black - do.

And that's why a whole lot of us like what the minutemen groups are doing because, so far as we can tell, they are the only people in this whole mess who have done anything to help residents sleep at night.

Signed
Somebody's Mother




20-year-resident



go to church and preach there

11.08.2005 14:54


oh great. a preacher too.
thanks for showing me the light, oh wise one.

your logic (And its consequences from my humble readings):
Humans are naturally evil.
They must be controlled.
Control happens through the government.
Governments should be state governments.
State governments should control borders.
Borders should be controlled with guns to stop the evil people.
With enough control, the evil people will stop coming into our space.
Their space has their government.
They are different.
They only listen to force.
I am helping them and they don't even know it.
I am good.
Freedom will reign.
God will reign his blessed kindgdom on earth for the good of all americans/mankind.
Peace will come after we strengthen our borders.
Borders give us our identity.
We are nothing without our country.
Humans can't exist without state governments.
History is history of the West (colonizers).
Our history proves us right.
Being right is good.
To be good is to keep out Evil.
They are evil. Stop the Evil.
They can be good if they listen to us. If they become like us.
God is Good.
Islam is bad.
War is necessary for keeping us good.
Without a border. there is chaos.
No Borders = Chaos.
'Chaos' = Freedom of Movement.
'Chaos' = People making their own decisions.
'Chaos' = Autonomy.
'Chaos' = complex self-organization.
'Chaos' = Bad.
We are good.

white american against minutemen



*drum roll*

11.08.2005 15:20


Thank you for your astute observations, Che Guevara.

Please, when you get a chance, find me historical evidence of an anarchist society resulting in a peaceful, autonomous bunch of happy people as opposed to autonomous roving gangs of conquerors like the Mongols.

Hey wow, that was some history of the EAST, wasn't it? Amazing.

How exactly, is the state controlling me in this the most free of countries, other than forcing me to pay taxes and obey their laws? Autonomy means you have the free choice of any one country of the world to live in, therefore you are autonomous.

Without an enforced border, with more than just a wall - a Border Patrol capable of doing their job - what 20 Year Resident mentioned would happen on a grander scale along with everything else that crosses the border.

Looking off to the horizon like some kind of coked out idealist talking about grand visions of a new world order involving "No nations", is truly insane. Whether or not you believe in God is irrelevant; man must be kept in check by man, and you may not believe it, but I and all Christians believe man must also be kept in check by God.

If everyone was magically just inherently good, we would need no self-government, no policing, no prisons. But obviously, historically, there is a need for men to be governed, as they are not perfect.

This is all a bunch of ethical and philosophical argument not related to the subject.

The subject here is that we as a sovreign nation have the right to enforce our borders the same as you as a citizen have the right to enforce the security of your own private property and home for the safety of yourself and your family.

I and every other law-abiding border resident, and Minuteman volunteer, will continue to protect our homes and families, and assist the Border Patrol in deterring any and all illegal activity along both the northern and southern borders to the best of our ability until the US Government takes action to fix the problem.

It seems your anarchist ideology does not mesh with the majority of American citizens, at least going by the last ~300 years of American history.

Obviously we can patrol the Iraqi/Syrian border pretty damn well, why can't we do it here?

La Migra's Helper



By the way

11.08.2005 15:35


I almost forgot to mention: When we learn that one of our neighbors has been beaten to death by a criminal illegal alien so he can steal her car, we go out and buy a SECOND gun so that we can go armed just to weed the garden.

Former anti-gun people change their religion. People who refused to have a gun in the house because of their children decide that their children are better off with a mother who can defend them. And we arrest every illegal alien we find on our land and turn them over to Border Patrol.

Former pacifists decide that pacifism is anti-survival. And we arrest every illegal alien we find on our land and turn them over to Border Patrol.

Walk a mile in my shoes before you decide to mock me. You know nothing about it. If protesters come on our land, we will arrest them too.



Somebody's Mother



Who are you guys?

11.08.2005 16:05



1. You know, I have not seen a single intelligent observation made from anyone in my age group. I am 21 and the future. It wasn't long ago when I started my job search. I cooked burgers to poured concrete, and I KNOW the score. Illegals don't get tax paying jobs and every fast food joint construction co. will lay someone off for a min. wage worker
2. I am also a protester. And am against the violation of human rights, and personal property. I like seeing people get paid more, and as long as a person knows english well enough, to tell me a storm drain pipe is falling on my head, I have no problem working with them. I was even in campo last saterday, with you guys. I was driving a thunderbird with signs taped allover it. I am protesting you Gente Unida. Who are you, and why are you in my back yard? I have to thank you though your SHENANIGANS on the border kept my dog's throat from getting sliced...... for a couple of days.

love
as simple as you

Somebody's son



Exhibit A

11.08.2005 16:10


Mr. Guevara -

Please observe Exhibit A, what happens when you leave your door open in a bad neighborhood, i.e. the Mexican border with CA, AZ, NM or TX.

You welcome in all the good people... and the bad people too.

Private residents like Somebody's Mother above have been dealing with this sort of thing for years before the Minuteman Project even got off the ground. We Minutemen are only being so effective because we are bound by the law to not come into any contact with illegal foreign nationals, give them any commands or return fire should they shoot at us. For me to legally be able to defend myself against threat of deadly force, I or one of my crew has to have already BEEN shot. I got shot at in Jacumba, my crew observed armed men on the other side of the border, not only firing amongst each other, (the drug cartel wars which are all but condoned by the Mexican govt.) but firing at us.

Even though I did absolutely nothing to defend myself other than hide behind a rock on in the dirt, I was harassed by a local Sherriff who was stuffing his face with Fritos, for carrying a sidearm unloaded to defend myself if need be.

Are we to simply lay down and roll over for these criminals who work with the tacit and even observed active assistance of their own Mexican law enforcement officers?

Like it or not, we are Americans, and we will not fold in the face of corrupt nations and criminals challenging our sovreignty.

La Migra's Helper



.......

11.08.2005 16:14


Somebody's son -

I'm not sure if you are pro-illegal immigration or anti-illegal immigration, but either way, I am 21 myself, so you're not the only one out here.

La Migra's Helper



Mexican flag

11.08.2005 16:29


Why does the mexican flag have a chicken and a worm on it?

Juan



Ummm

11.08.2005 16:54


I do believe that's an eagle with a snake...

La Migra's Helper



to solve crime, decriminalize immigrants

11.08.2005 20:30


Wanna reduce the criminal element attracted to trafficking in illegal aliens? The easiest way to do that would be to decriminalize immigration. No one's going to go traipsing about the desert with coyotes or other criminals if they can just ride the Greyhound. Worried about crimes committed by immigrants? Easy solution: arrest them WHEN they've committed the crime! I know, it sounds revolutionary. But it works ok for the domestic born. It could work for the foreign born as well.

As to drug trafficking, the best solution to that is: get the CIA out of that business. Leave it to the free market instead. Decriminalize drugs as well -- work towards harm minimization efforts instead of declaring "war" on everything left and right. We've been able to greatly reduce smoking in this country over the last forty years, without once sending out the military on "interdictions," or rounding up the tobacco "traffickers," or dropping defoliants over suspected illegal tobacco crops, or militarizing the borders of North Carolina, etc, etc.

ne1



Hmmmm

11.08.2005 20:41


Indeed, we packed the house so full, no more could get in! And we still outnumbered the Gente Unida types probably two to one! Very impressive show of force we had today.

Thankfully there were plenty of cops around to keep the protesters in check.

La Migra's Helper



Savor your "victories" where you can get 'em

11.08.2005 22:19


Well, Migra, savor your "victories" where you can, 'cause that's about the most you can hope for: a good rally with a couple ultraright Congress critters in a highschool gymnasium in the most rightwing corner of coastal San Diego, 30 miles out of town. Your crowd "won" prop 187 years ago too. But it didn't stand up in the courts, and this state's demographic has changed a lot since then. You'd never pass that monstrosity now, no matter how many Tom Tancredos you have organizing rallies for you.

But look at it this way: Maybe you all can form a good emotional support group, to cope with all the emotional distress having to live in a non-white majority state is causing you!

anti-Migra



Geez

12.08.2005 07:00


Good Lord... does nobody read the countless times I write about how this is not about race? I don't give a damn if I live in a predominantly non-white state. I care if I live in a SECURED predominantly non-white state into which people do not cross illegally, smuggling drugs and humans.

It's as if my opponents only hear me say what they want to hear.

And as for savoring victories, we've been savoring them since April in AZ, and they haven't really stopped coming. Especially considering the number of illegal crossings we deterred in Campo alone this past month according to Border Patrol statistics.

We have more than two congressmen on our side, read the news more often.

When will you people listen and stop crying "racist"?

La Migra's Helper



Racistracistracistracist...

12.08.2005 09:20


Ah, Helper, you see the folly of trying to have a reasonable conversation people who cover their ears and shout in order to avoid being discomforted with facts. They don’t want to hear it, so they simply scream racistracistracist repeatedly until the grownups just want to slap them.

That was what the grownups did in Carlsbad. People have been watching the protesters’ behavior at Campo and Garden Grove and elsewhere and I believe that is much of the reason they came in too great numbers to all get in and then stayed outside and drowned the protesters out with song. They were spanked for being ill-mannered, obnoxious and just plain mean.

They don’t move the dialogue forward at all with their antics. They simply confuse it with a bunch of made-up factoids (many garnered, if you look at earlier postings) from 20- and 30-year-old data that simply doesn’t apply anymore.

They don’t help anybody either. They’re not about to leave their comfy berths in the U.S. to help the Mexican people build schools and hospitals and businesses. They don’t help the people in Mexico build a middle class that has the clout and confidence to become an agent of change. If they cared about the Mexican people, that's what they would be doing. Instead, they hammer people like me - border residents who apparently aren't entitled to any consideration in the human rights dialogue. That leaves me to defend my own rights, and those of my children - not to mention our home and our lives.

These guys think they have the market cornered on “brotherhood” and “unity.” Well, they saw a good example of both from Americans of every color last night. The corporate masters they serve by trying to keep all that cheap controllable labor coming in must be getting pretty nervous by now.


Somebody's Mother



Overpopulation As A Social Issue

12.08.2005 19:42


The density of population has an impact on a broad range of social and economic issues, such as land prices and housing costs. For example, relatively densely populated countries such as Japan have higher land prices than less densely populated countries such as Australia, and even in that country, land prices have doubled and redoubled as the population has increased. It is sometimes argued that reducing the populations of some areas, such as large cities, would have positive benefits for these reasons. We are catching up to China and india In Population. I have been to both of these countries and I can tell you that their quality of life Sucks compared to the United States. All we ask is for no special favors to those that break our laws. Why should we be importing Third World Uneducated Peasents, Poverty, Dieseases, and Corruption to our country. Try to look at the big picture. I would rather pay $5.00 for a head of lettuce than to subsidize invaders with my tax money. It would be cheaper.
Declare all the illegals that are here U.S. Citizens........Just stop the unending flow of the masses........even you all must realize that our country is getting full.
R/ Skip


SKIP
e-mail:: dadakulit2002@yahoo.com



Respect the USA

22.08.2005 18:52


Forum stories were lopsided, misleading

Your Aug. 12 stories about the Carlsbad forum couldn't have been more
lopsided.

When you referred to "hundreds" of protesters, you failed to mention
that around 20 of them were a mixture of open-borders and anti-war
protesters.

The rest were the several hundred hopeful attendees of the forum who
couldn't get in due to space limitations. One of your writers also
referred to the attendees as "anti-immigration" supporters. As was
stated many times in the forum, they are "anti-illegal-immigration"
supporters.

Also, you made reference to the fact that only supporters of the
forum were allowed in. In fact, the first 420 in line were permitted
to attend. The rest were turned away due to lack of space.

Your insinuation that this was intentionally engineered by Roger
Hedgecock was ridiculous. But then, people who habitually cut into
the head of the line by sneaking across our border, rather than
applying for legal admission to this country like millions of others
do, wouldn't understand the concept of arriving early to get a good
seat.

Capt Skip
e-mail:: dadakulit2001@yahoo.com





Stories contributed to this site are licensed under the
Creative Commons Non Commercial - Share Alike - By Attribution license
unless otherwise specified by the author.